The few good bits are swamped by the many bad bits
When the movie, The Ten Commandments, was released in 1956 I was a 14-year-old devout Christian living in a small town in northern Indiana. I saw the film in our town’s only cinema, and was especially awestruck by the slender fiery finger of God descending from the sky to blast onto the stone tablets those famous ten commandments. Yes, that must have been exactly how it happened. I suspect that movie played a role in securing a firm place for this famous law code in American consciousness.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
I envisioned my first anthology The Christian Delusion to be an extension of my first book, Why I Became an Atheist. I thought it would be great to get experts to write on topics I addressed in my book. All the themes in it expand on issues raised in my very first book. I personally think The Christian Delusion delivers a powerful blow to conservative Christianity, especially when combined with its predecessor.
Dawkins: I named the book The Christian Delusion after Dawkins' popular bestseller The God Delusion. His focus was on God. Mine was focused on the Christian God. I had hoped it might get his attention. It didn't. In fact, none of the so-called New Atheists--publicly acknowledged my books.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
This anthology was named after Sam Harris's book The End of Faith like some others of mine. The so-called New Atheists took aim at God. My books took aim at Christianity in specific, because I knew the most about that religious faith.
After my first anthology, The Christian Delusion, I started telling authors the due date for their submissions was one month earlier than the actual deadline, to avoid last minute submissions. If I was concerned how the chapter was going I would ask for an outline, or rough draft along the way.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
I had wanted the subtitle to be "How to Know Which Religion Is True If There Is One, since I don't think there is one. But that was rejected by my publisher for some ignorant reason I forget now.
Most of my books were conceived and tested on this blog in debates with believers. This is the case with this book more than any other. Here's the Amazon link to my book. In it I'm arguing for a fair test to help believers examine their own faith honestly, without any special pleading or double standards. I am arguing that every honest seeker should embrace it. This should be seen in the first few pages of my book. While I think the test leads to unbelief, that's a separate debate.
The first thing to say is that Rauser contacted me to co-write the book without first reading my magnum opus Why I Became an Atheist. That's instructive, since he didn't research into how formidable of an opponent I might be.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
The first thing you should know is that the publisher wanted to name this
book, Deliver Us From Evil. Since my goal was to produce books named
after the
Four Horsemen
(plus Victor Stenger, who just missed that party with his 2007 NY Times
Bestseller, God: The Failed Hypothesis), I was adamantly opposed to it. So was Richard Carrier, and I think
Russell Blackford, who all voiced our objections.
On hindsight, after
I failed to edit a book named after Daniel Dennett's book, like Breaking the Christian Spell,
I wish we had used that provocative title instead. It sounds sexy doesn't it? Deliver Us From Evil. I like it now, especially after the rise to
power of Christian Theocratic/Nationalists with the twice impeached one-term former
President Donald Trump, and the January 6th failed coup attempt on American
democracy after failing to steal a presidential election.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
You should know that this book, How to Defend the Christian Faith: Advice from an Atheist, is one I thought about doing before any of my books were published. You can read what I said back in 2006, the year I began blogging. Almost ten years later I did a series of fifteen posts titled, "Do You Want to Be A Christian Apologist? Part 1...15". From them I wrote Part 2 of this book. That same year I did a series of posts on every chapter in God and Evil: The Case for God in a World Filled with Pain,edited by Chad Meister. They became the basis of Part 3 of this book. [Sorry, all deleted now].
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
Today let's consider my 2016 book, Unapologetic: Why Philosophy of Religion Must End. Just like my books The Outsider Test for Faith, and How To Defend the Christian Faith, this one was also forged in the heat of debate here at DC. I don't expect Christian philosophers to agree with it until after they abandon their faith. Secular philosophers have disagreed with it. But noteworthy ones agree. Actually, I think most all scientifically minded atheist philosophers should agree.
One crucial, fundamental rule for responsible Bible study—pursued by adults who can set aside “what the church says”—is this: be curious, be very curious. Another fundamental rule follows as well: be skeptical, be very skeptical. This requires looking below the surface, which should include exploring the writings of biblical scholars: every chapter and verse of the Bible has been studied closely, and the results published.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts.
Firstly, Christianity in the Light of Science was dedicated to Victor Stenger, the fifth horseman, who had written:
Throughout history, arguments for and against the existence of God have been largely confined to philosophy and theology. In the meantime, science has sat on the sidelines and quietly watched this game of words march up and down the field. . . . In my 2003 book, Has Science Found God? I critically examined the claims of scientific evidence for God and found them inadequate. In this present book, I will go much farther and argue that by this moment in time science has advanced sufficiently to be able to make a definitive statement on the existence or nonexistence of a God having the attributes that are traditionally associated with the Judeo-Christian-Islamic God. --From the Preface to God: The Failed Hypothesis.
After disagreeing with my chosen title for my earlier book, Christianity is not Great, Prometheus Books accepted my book proposal on the condition they would have the final say in naming it. They basically didn't want it named after Stenger's NY Times Bestselling book, such as Christianity: The Failed Hypothesis. After eliminating a few titles it came down to two:
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts. This time we look at The Case against Miracles. [See Tag Below]
After a two year break from producing another anthology (2017-18), due mostly to dating and marrying my wife Sheila. I finally decided to do one again. My decision came from debates on Facebook with Richard Carrier and Matthew Ferguson over the use of Bayes' Theorem in assessing miracles, plus the prodding of Richard Miller (who now posts here at DC). Dr. Miller and I were going to co-edit the book together but it just didn't work out. I thank him for prodding me to do it, and I think the book might have been better if it had worked out.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts. This time it's Varieties of Jesus Mythicism: Did He Even Exist? [See Tag Below].
Here is the Amazon link to get this "sure to be a classic" book, right here!
Zuckerman: Phil Zuckerman asked me why I chose to co-edit a book with Robert M. Price, a known supporter of Donald Trump. Well actually, Bob choose me to co-write it. After editing an anthology on The Empty Tomb more than a decade ago, he didn't want to do that again. So Bob asked me. He already had most of the authors. What I did was to acquire two additional authors and get it published. He already knew this is the kind of thing I do well from previous anthologies.
I'm done writing and editing books, so I'm highlighting each one of them in thirteen separate posts. [See Tag Below]
God and Horrendous Suffering is the last book I wrote/edited. It was the last one I procured a contract for, the last one I submitted chapters for, and the last one being shipped to buyers. It's published by the prestigious Global Center for Religious Research, whose President is Dr. Darren Slade. If you click on just one link to find out about the book and/or buy a copy click here to GCRR. It contains the Abstract, my Author Bio, a few key Reviews, and Dr. Slade's excellent 5th chapter, Failed to Death: Misotheism and Childhood Suffering. Most importantly, whether it's a hardcopy, a PDF, or a Kindle eBook, you won't be able to buy them for less anywhere else. [I like this as it takes away some power and money from Jeff Bezos.] Two other important links include an eight page paper by me introducing the problem of horrendous suffering, right here, plus the fantastic blurbs it has received so far.
Trying to get them to read, study, ponder the Bible
One of the old hymns I recall from my Methodist upbringing is Leaning on the Everlasting Arms, which includes these words: “What a blessedness, what a peace is mine, leaning on the everlasting arms. Leaning, leaning, safe and secure from all alarms…” Safe and secure. This security inside the Christian shelter can happen when doubts are denied, when troublesome thoughts are dismissed: “Our priests and preachers must have it right. We believed them when we were toddlers, so why be suspicious now? We’ll keep the faith.” Take it on faith.
“See the USA in your Chevrolet, America is asking you to call, drive your Chevrolet through the USA, America’s the greatest land of all…”
We had no doubt that America was the greatest land, a sentiment that fueled our patriotism at the time. But we didn’t really think about it. As kids we also played “cowboys and Indians”—however, it never dawned on us that it was through massive genocide ofnative Americans that European descendants took possession of what is now the USA. Nor did we give much thought to the role that slavery played in the unfolding of American history. Slavery impacted how the US constitution was written; it provoked a bloody civil war, and left an ugly legacy of racism, which still poisons our society.
Shermer makes this point extremely well, and it's a very important one. Since faith is not a reliable method for determining moral values we must figure it out ourselves. Period. End of story. Don't ask where we get our morals from. We derive them out of the need for other people, our families, friends, communities, counties and our world, without which life on our planet could be chaotic, unstable and miserable. An extremely large part of dysfunction and chaos comes from using faith as a guide to morals. THIS MUST STOP! LINK.
I'm still working through Mark Mittelberg's apologetical book. It's a good one, better than most in that it's a unique, easily accessible one for popular readers, and better than Lee Strobel's type of books. Click on Mark's name below to see where we've been so far. Now on with the show for his chapter 11, where he shares 7 more arrows that point to the Bible as true. No, I'm not going to be comprehensive in responding here.
This took place on William Lane Craig's Facebook wall.
John Loftus: There is meaning and value and purpose in life. There just isn't any ultimate meaning and value and purpose for all sentient beings who have existed, or currently exist, or will exist into the distant future.
A few years ago, a Christian friend told me, after attending Easter morning service, that he had been so moved by the scriptural reading, I Corinthians 15, in which the apostle Paul claims that Jesus
“…was raised on the third day in accordance with the scripturesand that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers and sisters at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have died.” (vv. 4-6)
How to Change
the Minds of Believers by John W. Loftus
After
spending nearly two decades trying to change the minds of Christian believers
(my focus in what follows) I still don’t fully know how to do it. Regardless, I’ll
share ten helpful tips for readers who, like me, want to bang your heads
against a wall. I think it’s worth doing despite the low odds of success. For any
success helps rid the world of the harms of religion. Besides, one of the
greatest challenges is to change minds, and I like challenges. Plus, I’ve
learned a great deal by attempting this important underappreciated task.
Michael Shermer recently wrote about his trip to Köln, Germany, where he stood amazed at "the magnificent cathedral in the city center that has defined the region for nearly eight centuries." [Photos included] Shermer says "It is a reminder of the power of faith in a pre-modern world lit only by fire and plagued by poverty, disease, misery, and early death." He really explains what it was like living in the latter Middle Ages, and how science displaced superstitious thinking. Awesome!
On this trip to the Cologne Cathedral I time-traveled back to the latter Middle Ages and into the late Medieval mind to imagine what it must have been like to experience the awe-inspiring magnificence of such a culturally-dominant edifice that literally and figuratively puts all other structures in the shade. Imagine walking into this sanctuary after a long and exhaustive journey from one’s provincial countryside and spartan abode....
To fully feel that world let’s go back to a time when civilization was lit only by fire, centuries ago when populations were sparse and 80 percent of everyone lived in the countryside and were engaged in food production, largely for themselves. Cottage industries were the only ones around in this pre-industrial and highly-stratified society, in which one-third to one-half of everyone lived at subsistence level and were chronically under-employed, underpaid, and undernourished. Food supplies were unpredictable and plagues decimated weakened populations. Read further here.
Evangelical Christians have been bailing ship in the last few decades. They have been moving to "mainstream" versions", "liberal" versions, and Catholic versions. The young ones are a growing group of the "nones" who don't embrace any organized religion at all.
There have been a few intellectual evangelical Christians who became Catholics in recent decades, most notably Francis Beckwith (b. 1960): A philosopher and theologian, he was elected president of the Evangelical Theological Society but converted to Catholicism in 2007.
I did a quick search and found conflicting accounts of the numbers of evangelicals who switched to Catholicism, as opposed to the numbers of Catholics who switched to Evangelicalism, without arriving at a firm conclusion.
Which brings me to Cameron Bertuzzi of the highly popular "Capturing Christianity" apologetics ministry. Ten days ago he announced that he's switching from evangelicalism to Catholicism. It's getting noticed with 76k hits so far.
Carl Sagan was in high demand as a public speaker, and during the Q&A periods, he reports that a common question was, “Do you believe in God?” His response was to ask a question:
“Because the word God means many things to many people, I frequently reply by asking what the questioner means by ‘God.’ To my surprise, this response is often considered puzzling or unexpected: ‘Oh you know, God. Everyone knows who God is.’ Or ‘Well, kind of a force that is stronger than we are and exists everywhere in the universe.’ There are a number of such forces. One of them is called gravity, but it is not often identified with God. And not everyone does know what is meant by ‘God.’ The concept covers a wide range of ideas.” (pp. 181-182, Broca’s Brain: Reflections on the Romance of Science)
Oh you know, God. We live in a god-saturated culture. God in whom we can trust is on our money; the god whom we are under is in our pledge of allegiance; the Bible—god’s word—is in millions of hotel rooms. There are hundreds of thousands of churches built to the glory of god throughout the country. It’s hardly any wonder that people can say, Oh you know, God.
My conclusion is the Bible says what it says until refuted by reason, morality, and/or science, then it says something other than what it says. No joke!
I was honored to write the Foreword to Robert Conner's excellent new book The Jesus Cult: 2000 Years of the Last Days, which you can get on Amazon.
It was long, so understandedly Conner had to edit it down. Here it is in it's entirety.
Paul’s Christianity: Belief in Belief Itself
Citing plenty of Roman writers familiar with the early Jesus Cult, along with teasing out the true meaning from Christian sources, Robert Conner makes a solid case that “Christianity was a cult from its inception, a toxic brew of apocalyptic delusion, sexual phobias and fixations, with a hierarchy of control of women by men, of slaves by masters, and of society by the church.” It had an “irrational and antisocial nature” to it, and “its destructive features remain a clear and present danger today. Its greatest threat is the core feature of the Christian cult: belief in belief, the conviction that the Christian narrative is literally its own proof.”
To say I agree with Conner is a huge understatement. I love how he writes! Readers will find in his book a great amount of erudition combined with an unmatched use of rhetoric and even hilarity. I am honored and delighted to write this Foreword for another excellent book by him.
Connor says Christianity was nothing more than a cult “in the most pejorative sense of the word.” In the chapters to follow he makes his case, showing that religious cults share with Christianity “several familiar features” like “a fixation on sexual purity, bizarre interpretations of scripture, and often a preoccupation with End Times theology which leads members to interpret events through an apocalyptic lens.”
Scientists like Darwin discovered evolution as an answer to why there are so many species, including human beings. It undercut the creation accounts in Genesis 1 & 2, Psalms 104, and Job 38-42, which can no longer be taken as straightforward accounts, but are now considered nonhistorical myths. The Bible can no longer be considered as a scientific textbook, to say the very least.
So the question of the origins of life itself is not something to be answered in the Bible. This question is proving to be as elusive as the origins of species. But if it is to be solved, scientists will solve it.
Q. Are we sure the Bible was ever specifically authored as a scientific text book?
A. It offers the pre-scientific mind knowledge about those areas it talks about. In Genesis we learn why people die, why there are rainbows, where rain comes from, and why snakes slither across land. We also learn that stars are hung in the firmament just above the mountains. They teach how the universe originated, which god created it, why women were subservient to men, why there is pain in childbirth, why we live with thorns, why work is hard, and why there are different languages. Just picture this before the rise of science that could dispute it all. God didn't know anything about the universe yet he allegedly created it.
Here’s a sensational headline that would shock the world: Pope Resigns, Issuing a Statement that He No Longer Believes in God. But we’ll never see such a headline because, even if a pope stepped down because of nonbelief, the Vatican hierarchy wouldn’t allow such honesty. Other more palatable reasons would be given. I once asked a prominent Italian television journalist if it could possibly be true that the Vatican clergy really believed the theology-on-steroids that the church promotes, e.g. such wackiness as transubstantiation, the immaculate conception, Mary’s bodily assumption into heaven. He responded, “Oh, maybe half of them do. But don’t forget, it’s a business.”
My wife Sheila and I feed the homeless once a week. We do so in the parking lot of the rescue mission downtown out of the back of my old Jimmy. We have gotten to know some of the homeless and their stories.
We do it to help those in need. If one of them says anything like "God bless you" or "Thanks be to God", I tell him/her we're just being good. We don't believe in God.
One guy approached me recently and said he bought and read my book Why I Became an Atheist, and that it changed his life. "How so?" I asked. He said he no longer believes in God.
Now you might think this is a bad thing, since believing in God can help people down on their luck. Not so!
AA hasn't helped him stay sober, neither has God, his higher power. So depending on God didn't work. He said it makes much better sense to rely on yourself. Relying on God is an excuse when you fail. God will also easily forgive you when you fail, and you know it.
Relying on himself forced him to take ownership of his own life, and decisions.
He's been sober about two months now. What we know is that so far he's doing better than he did when relying on a god.
The apostle Paul and John Calvin did their fair share of damage
Christians who are sure that the New Testament reveals a loving god aren’t paying close attention. One of the charter documents of the Christian faith is Paul’s Letter to the Romans. In the opening chapter we find a list of people who deserve to die, because they don’t acknowledge God. The list includes gossips and rebellious children, “…since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a base mind and to improper conduct.” (Romans 1:28). “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness…” (Romans 1:18) And there’s more: “...by your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God’s righteous judgment will be revealed.” (Romans 2:5) “…for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury.” (Romans 2:8)
A new paper of mine was appropriately published at Halloween, over on Internet Infidels.
My focus in this paper is to expose the special pleading of William Lane Craig’s psychic epistemology (or spirit-guided epistemology) as I correctly call it—rather than reformed epistemology as it’s known. I consider this to be an extension of a book of mine, where I offer good advice to the Christian apologist. In part one, after questioning the need for apologetics and warning about the monumental challenges to it, I tell apologists to become honest life-long seekers of the truth, to get a good education in a good field of study, to accept nothing less than sufficient objective evidence, and especially to determine how to know which religion to defend. I offer good solid tongue-in-cheek advice for apologists.[1] LINK.
Must watch! Must share! This is the best approach I've seen to help Trump loyalists question their loyalty to him. Please share with your right-wing friends!
"A former GOP congressman, a rising Young Republican; a party-loyal Ohio farmer; a US Army Veteran & hardcore 'MAGA'; and 3 evangelicals recount their evolutions from Trump supporters in 2016 to adamant adversaries in 2020."
All of our god(s) were invented in utter, total isolation
If the Bible is what the devout claim it is, we should be able to trust the information it provides about god, right? Alas, so often—far too often—that’s hard to do. How do modern Christians feel about these two verses, Exodus 29:17-18, i.e., proper worship procedure regarding animal sacrifice:
“Then you shall cut the ram into its parts and wash its entrails and its legs and put them with its parts and its headand turn the rest of the ram into smoke on the altar. It is a burnt offering to theLORD; it is a pleasing odor, an offering by fire to theLORD.”
I’m assuming not too many Christians would welcome this kind of smokey ritual on Sunday mornings. The author of this text believed that (1) his god was close enough overhead to smell the smoke from the fire; (2) his god had a sense of smell; (3) his god savored the aroma of burning animal flesh. Of course, this is a sampling of primitive, superstitious religion: one way to get right with a god was animal sacrifice. Another aspect of primitive religion is disguised here by the English translation. The word LORD in all caps is the rendering of the divine name; this god’s name was Yahweh—as reconstructed from four Hebrew consonants (add different vowels and you get Jehovah). Calling on the name of the god is a kind of magic, which survives to this day when Christians say, “…in Jesus’ name we pray.”
[First published on 10/5/20] Because this is the haunted month of Halloween
here's something to spook ya all!
I'm always interested in new angles to argue my case
against Christianity. Kris Keys does that in the excellently researched
essay below. He argues there is more evidence for the resurrection of
Vampires and Revenants than there is for the resurrection of
Jesus.
Introductory comments by Kris Keys:
Well this is my first time writing a blog post and little
did I know it would be for the website Debunking Christianity!! I find
this to be completely hilarious as I am not in of myself militantly
opposed to Christianity in of itself; I tend to dislike Evangelicals but
that is because I view them as hypocritical and blatantly power hungry
but of course this description would not apply to all Christians. As
probably the readers of this post have deduced by now I am not a
Christian, but I am also not an atheist either. I tend to be rather
eclectic in my views. I fancy myself to be broad minded and open to
change.
I am a schoolteacher by profession, and I have taught both social
studies and science at the high school level. I have dual degrees in
both fields. In my not remotely enough spare time I enjoy reading
folklore, Medieval history, sociology, anthropology and other subjects.
Basically a lot of stuff. Over the years I have heard the
Christian argument for the physical resurrection of Jesus and at one
time I found this argument to be convincing, but more and more for many
varied reasons I became rather skeptical of it.
None of this explains though, how this essay came about! Nothing
remarkable about it really. I was scrolling through Facebook and I saw
John Loftus’s profile. In discussion with him I mentioned that one could
use the resurrection argument to demonstrate the existence of vampires
and I showed him a response I wrote to a friend of mine on this.
John asked me to do a write up
for him.
So here is a write up I never seriously figured I would write up on a
blog, one that I never suspected I would write for. So I hope everyone enjoys
it. So without further ado, here is my attempt to show that the
Christian argument for the resurrection of Jesus would also demonstrate
vampires exist. I will leave it up to you dear readers to determine if
Jesus rose from the dead and if you need to invest in crucifixes and
garlics now; or that perhaps claims of the dead returning bodily just
should not be given the benefit of the doubt. You decide.
Directly below are a few links to what our authors have written about abortion.
--Why I Write and Write and Write About the Religious Right, by Teresa Roberts. Commenting on Bob Nononi, a Republican politician from Idaho, who said in a public forum that maybe we should consider the death penalty for women who get an abortion, she unloads the harms of the religious right in general. "Right under our very noses, we are becoming a theocracy and people by in large are refusing to believe it’s happening...The religious right is no longer willing to sit on the sidelines as their cross-eyed cousins once did, talking in tongues, handling snakes, beating their kids and oppressing their women. Watching the rest of Americans live their own lives as they please infuriates them. They're here to tell you that they're no longer a joking matter. They're serious. Dead serious. Furthermore, they're winning which is making them bolder by the minute."
--Why is the Religious Right Obsessed With Abortion?, by Teresa Roberts. She argues: "Abortion has evolved into a single driving issue of such monumental proportions in part because society has become far more secularized than we realize. The shift away from a moral code dictated by churches and enforced by government has caused a great deal of discomfort for individuals and institutions that once wielded so much power over our lives. They are now struggling to reclaim what they perceive as their god given right to determine and enforce the new moral code that defines modern culture. They feel the shifting tide as they continue to lose their tight grip on the reins of society. It has turned them into crusaders, not just for the protection of the unborn but for a return to the glory days when the church had the final and last say over what would be tolerated and what would not."
--Birds of a Fundy Feather, by minister-turned-atheist Joe Holman. In commenting on Eric Rudolph, the famous abortion clinic bomber, Holman argues: "The Christian fundamentalist mindset is dangerous. It devalues life and appreciates one that exists only in fantasy. It enslaves the rational mind, empowering an otherwise conscionable individual to do inhumane things with feelings of integral justification, or at the very least, creates support and sympathy for those who so act."
--Apologist Edward Feser gets into the debate by comparing George Tiller, an abortionist doctor, to Jeffrey Dahmer who killed, dismembered and ate 17 men and boys. Feser says, "Tiller was almost certainly a more evil man than Dahmer was." LINK, with a follow-up LINK.
--In a tongue-in-cheek essay, Why Conservative Christians Should Love Abortion, Franz Kiekeben takes seriously William Lane Craig's arguments that slaughtered innocent children go to heaven, and draws the conclusion that so do aborted fetuses. Hence, "Christian conservatives should be encouraging women to get pregnant for the sole purpose of aborting their fetuses — and doing this as often as they can! They should stop protesting abortion clinics and instead hand out fliers informing women of the religious benefits associated with the practice, and encouraging them to do the godly thing."
--God Loves Abortion, by Jonathan Pearce. "Given the statistics that fetuses die from natural, spontaneous abortions, or miscarriages; abortions that God has the power to stop, and seemingly designed in to the system in the first place, then.... either God is not omnibenevolent; or God does not exist; or embryos are not so sacred and arguments over what defines personhood are called for; or that millions of fetal deaths a year, unknown to humanity, are necessary for a greater good."
--About fifteen years ago I participated in a written debate with an atheist over abortion, which can be found at DC here. I think I laid out a reasonable case for a women's right to abortion.
[First posted on 4/2019] To help inform everyone on the sanctity of life here's a chapter written by Dr. Ronald A. Lindsay for my anthology Christianity is Not Great: Why Faith Fails. It's a work that details the harms of the Christian faith and why we oppose it. We pick up after Lindsay discusses the messy sanctity of life principle as applied to end of life decisions. [See a previous post which has several essays on abortion and the Christian right found here.]
Below you'll watch Willie Dave (David Elie) so full of life, singing his very last Karaoke song Wednesday night. His specialty was imitating songs of Willie Nelson, Bob Dylan, and Frank Sinatra. I especially liked the Sinatra song below. He looks so full of life at the age of 71. Twelve hours later he suffered a heart attack and died! This was a shock to everyone. He was a good friend of mine. We hung out, sang Karaoke together, and camped together with our gals in Florida. He was also a fan of right-wing politics and did some interesting end-times prophecy stuff, which we debated. He was a good man. I loved him. Recently we were texting each other about NFL football, and when we could get together again in Florida.
Each time I watch the video I shed a few tears. You never know. Death awaits us too. He will be missed greatly. My deepest sympathies go out to Ginny, and others. I wish I could do something to help. Maybe writing this tribute will do so. Ginny tells us, "Dave loved life! He woke every morning and prayed. Then he would say, 'Its going to be a great day - I get to spend it with my Ginny.'" Now watch a man full of life singing his last song. See what an amazing fortuitous song it was too!
Worship services are a form of show business, at which some Christian brands excel especially. How much does the Vatican spend every year on its worship costumes alone? But most denominations, while not so extravagant, do their best to “put on the show,” which includes music, liturgy, ritual, props, sets—those stained-glass depictions of Bible stories—and the trained actors, i.e., the clergy. All this is designed to promote the beliefs and doctrines of each denomination. But there are so many different denominations: who is getting Christianity right? Is there any denomination that urges its followers to look beyond the liturgies? What’s behind it all? What are the origins of the beliefs celebrated in liturgies?
One way to do this, if you really want to know, is to assume what you currently believe is false. That is step #1. Step #2 is to demand the sort of evidence that a judge would allow in court. Step #3 is to produce that evidence or give up what you currently believe. No excuses. No double standards.
There are exceptions, like disputes over beauty, or other subjective preferences, but the exceptions cannot be the rule.
An apologist asked me this question:
"Do you think that if a creator created us that we should be accountable in some way to this creator?" My answer:
No. If a creator exists we have no obligation to him if we are given metaphysically free self-determination. He can impose such a thing on us, but that's something he should negotiate with us. God has no right to command us to do good without providing good reasons for being good. And if those reasons are indeed good ones we should be able to discover them without him having to command them.
No one should be above the law, not even the lawmaker. That's why a kingship model of God in the Bible is offensive, as found in the story of Job, since kings could do whatever they could get away with doing. If a god exists he must be subject to his own laws. "Thou shall not kill, lie or steal" as they apply. By contrast the social contract is a negotiated one. Democracy is a participatory type of government.
If a creator god wants to be praised or thanked he should earn it. Now of course, we would give praise to him and thank him for life. But we should only praise and thank such a god as his creation is a good one, and his deeds in the world are good ones.
I co-edited the book "Varieties of Jesus Mythicism" with my friend Dr. Robert M. Price. In comes Dr. Richard Carrier, also a friend of mine and peer-reviewed author of a very important book on Jesus mythicism. These two friends of mine have personalities that are almost opposite of each other. Bob is a gracious person when it comes to disagreements. By contrast Dick is, well, a dick. :-) He's someone who holds no punches such that there were authors who didn't want him included in our book, despite being the first peer-reviewed author of an important peer-reviewed book on Jesus Mythicism.
Carrier recently reviewed our mythicist book. He liked some chapters and trashed some others. So I wrote a defense of it, LINK. He did write a blurb for our book though:
Mainstream experts mostly already agree the miraculous Jesus didn’t exist, but what about a merely human Jesus? This anthology usefully exhibits the full gamut of doubting even that, from the absurd to the sound. Some contributions are not credible, but some are worth considering, and several are brilliant, indeed required reading for anyone exploring the subject. The book will be absolutely necessary for any future Jesus mythicist scholar. - Dr. Richard Carrier, peer-reviewed author of On the Historicity of Jesus.
Having previously been called a "doofus" when it comes to Bayes Theorem, I know the sting of a review by Carrier. In my defense I myself had a peer-reviewed paper published on Bayes Theorem at Internet Infidels, where the vice-President said it was one of the best papers he ever had the pleasure of reading and approving! Carrier still has not responded to it, but if he does, he may overwhelm me with words and links galore, burying me in so much work I won't be able to respond to it all, if I do. Yet, I'm sure I have basically refuted his case. No, Bayes is not the tool for assessing miraculous claims, which by their very nature are impossible to take place in the natural world, by means of the natural world. I have argued that Bayes cannot and should not be applied to claims which are nonsense, and that miraculous claims in the ancient Biblical past are all nonsense! They are all nonsense because there is absolutely no credible evidence for any of them. Lately I offered some additional thoughts on Bayes.
By the way, I want to know about the peer-review process when it comes to Carrier's book on Jesus. Please tell us Dr. Carrier! If anyone takes a minute to search for it, there are varying methods and goals in peer-review. What is not promised is that the book is setting forth something true and factual. It only means, at best, that an author has dealt with all of the most important objections.
I know that Sheffield Phoenix Press is a highly esteemed scholarly liberal book publisher. I also know publishers want provocative books that sell well (despite any claim otherwise), since money is indeed a factor. This is not to impugn Sheffield Phoenix Press, and its editors, or any of its authors, including Carrier, since it's very significant that a mythicist got a book published by this publisher! [Atheist scholar Hector Avalos also published two books with them]. But peer-review does not mean the particular reviewer (or committee) thinks what Carrier wrote is true. Yes, we should definately read what Carrier writes. We just don't need reminded that his work was peer-reviewed so often, nor does it mean Carrier's particular treatment is the end of all Jesus mythicism studies, or that Carrier gets to be the hall-monitor for every mythicist who writes on the same subject.
As I said in an earlier post, I don't care much at all with how the Jesus character originated. What I know is that the Jesus in the four gospels did not exist. I said so in my Preface. I also said each and every one of the theories presented in the book are possible. That's my starting point. Possibility is good enough.
With that in mind I'm posting what Joe Atwill sent me in response to Carrier. I did not solicit it, but I welcome it.
The Elephant in Richard Carrier’s Room: A Lesson for NT Scholarship By Joseph Atwill
Richard Carrier has written a critique of two of the parallels I discussed in the chapter I wrote for "Varieties of Jesus Mythicism." SOURCE
I wish to respond.
A personal, loving, competent god is out of the question
When we study episodes of colossal suffering in human history, we have to wonder: “How did belief in a good, powerful god survive these experiences?” The masses of people affected would have been more than justified in telling their priests to get lost. “The theology you’ve been peddling is all wrong.” The Black Plague of the 14th century, which brought horrible suffering and death to perhaps a third of the population from India to England, should have meant the end of personal theism, i.e., belief that a loving god manages the world, indeed, keeps close tabs on every person on earth. Unfortunately, critical thinking was not a common commodity at that time, so the church got away with preaching that human sin was the cause of the plague; god was getting even. This is stunningly bad theology, the embrace of supernatural evil, as Dan Barker has put it: the loving god had disappeared.
Here's a map of 56,000 galaxies! It's estimated there are between 100 to 200 billion galaxies. We're in such a small little tiny part in the universe! We know so very very little. To believe there's a god who transcends all time, who knows what's going on in every planet of every galaxy, who created it all in an instant for his glory and our worship, is ludacris! LINK
